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Dear Dinesh —
You said:
Thank-you for
your reply. You've said that I am
disrespectful. I respect Mary but
won't worship or bow before one of
her statues as millions of Catholics
do, simply by obeying the man-made
doctrines of the Church of Rome.
- Have you actually met anyone
who worships Mary or do you just
assume that because someone bows
before her statue that they are
worshiping her?
- I mean, did you actually ask
them, "Are you worshiping
Mary as equal to God" and
gotten an affirmative answer?
We do not worship Mary. God alone
deserves worship. If you go to a
Catholic Mass, you'll find Mary mentioned
twice in passing, in the context
of others, neither of which, are
acts of worship.
It's very clear when you go to a
Catholic Mass who we worship.
Bowing is not inherently a form of
worship; it's just a form of respect.
Japanese bow to each other as a form
of greeting. The same was true among
the Hebrews. I'm sure you'll quote
the first commandment, but the exact
same Hebrew phraseology used in first
commandment in Exodus is used by
righteous Isaac in speaking to Jacob
in Genesis 27:29:
"May nations serve you and
peoples bow down to you."
Even the prophet Nathan, surely a
righteous man, bowed before the king. So
they told the king, saying,
“Here is Nathan the prophet.” And
when he came in before the king,
he bowed down before the king
with his face to the ground. 1
Kings 1:23
David did too:
"Then David went out of the
cave and called out to Saul, 'My
Lord and king!' When Saul looked
behind him, David bowed down and
prostrated himself with his face
to the ground." 1 Samuel
24:8
In David's song of praise to the
Lord he says:
"You made my adversaries
bow at my feet."
2 Samuel 22:40
Also Psalm 18:39:
You armed me with strength for
battle; you made my adversaries
bow at my feet.
So bowing was commonly done between
human beings. It is not, therefore,
against God's law to bow down before
Mary, as long as it is done merely
to honor, and not to worship.
I say you are disrespectful, not
because you won't honor Mary, but
because you basically call her an
incompetent mother. It is one thing
to honor. It is another to remain
reserved and objective.
It's quite another to accuse someone
of being an incompetent mother.
You said:
My Lord has not
taught me to do so. You asked me
if I've done anything stupid.
I would be doing something if I believe
and follow what you have said in
your reply.
- Is this what Jesus would have
you say?
You said:
If the women
mentioned in Revelation was Mary,
John would have surely named her!
- What makes you think that?
In John 2:1-3 and John 19:25-26,
John calls her the "mother of
Jesus" and does not call her
by name. In Revelation 12:5, he says
the woman "brought forth
a male child, one who is to rule
all the nations with a rod of iron." This
can only be Jesus, hence the one
who brought him forth is Mary. So
essentially, John is calling her
the mother of Jesus, just using more
indirect terms.
You said:
You think you
are a genius, more brilliant than
John, and that others are stupid.
According to you, wherever the word women or queen are
mentioned, whether it is in the Psalms
or Revelation, it should be considered
as Mary.
My reasons are more subtle than that.
I am distilling a lot of deep study
into the Scriptures into a short
explanation. Unfortunately, time
does not permit me to go into all
the details of why, since much of
this is based on an exhaustive reading
of Scripture.
You said:
Don't be so childish
in saying Mary is our mother. Jesus
never called her mother even once
in the Bible.
- What did he call her? "Woman"
- Where did that come from? Genesis
3:16
He did this to tie her to the fulfillment
of Genesis 3:16.
- Why else would he dare to call
his own mother "Woman"?
- Is it not written, "Honor
your father and mother" and
did Jesus not fulfill the law
perfectly?
- Do you really think that Jesus
would be as disrespectful toward
his mother as you seem to be inclined
to be?
You said:
Coming back to
that story, after finding Him, His
mother said to him
"Son, why have
you done this to us?" Luke
2:48
He answered them:
"Why did you
have to look for me? Didn't you
know that I had to be in the Father's
house"? But they, [Mary,]
didn't understand His answer.
Luke 2:49-50
Mary didn't understand
what Jesus said to her at the time.
Now you want me and others to pray
along with you, to Mary and have
Mary intercede for us and save us
at the hour of our death.
Only God, not Mary,
knows the time of my death and your
death.
Sir, you do not know what Mary does
and does not know. For all you know
it is the Lord's sovereign will to
reveal such things to her. The most
you can say is that we have no sure
evidence from Scripture that she
knows. Knowledge of the life to come
is far beyond your comprehension
(and mine), and it would be sheer
arrogance to presume that we know
with certainty what those who have
fallen asleep in Christ know.
"Eye has not seen, nor ear
heard, nor have entered into the
heart of man the things which
God has prepared for those who
love Him.” (1 Corinthians
2:9)
In Revelation, chapter 5 verse 8
we see the elders in heaven carrying "bowls
of incense" which "are
the prayers of the saints".
So we know that those in heaven are
involved in carrying our prayers
to God seated on the throne. Saintly
intercession is real.
You said:
For asking this
you call me stupid. The passage your
quoted: 1 Timothy 2 :1, talks about
praying for others not praying to
others.
As you know, the official language
of the Catholic Church is Latin.
In Latin, the word for "pray", orare,
is the same as the word to ask.
When we pray "to" someone,
we are not worshiping them, we are
merely asking them to pray for
us. We can do so because
the saints carry our prayers to the
throne room of God (Revelation 5:8),
and, frankly, if for no other reason,
the saints surround us. (Hebrews
12:1,23) We also know it is possible
because of Jeremiah 15:1.
You said:
Just go a little
further to 1 Timothy 2:5 and it says
there is one God and one mediator
between men and God,
the man Christ Jesus.
5 For there is one
God, and there is one mediator
between God and men, the man Christ
Jesus, (1Timothy 2:5)
Jesus never said, "Ask
in my mother Mary's name."
Well, that's not what we're asking;
we're asking in Jesus's name through
the intercession of Mary, just as
we ask our brothers and sisters on
earth for their intercessory prayers.
You said:
"So that
whatever you ask the Father
in my name, he may give it
to you."
(John 15:16)
Mary, the respectful,
earthly mother of Jesus said,
5 "His
mother said to the servants, "Do
whatever he tells you."
(John 2:5)
but the Mary
of the man-made Church of Rome
keeps on giving apparitions and
speaks words of blasphemy, saying
she is the:
- Queen of
Heaven,
- Queen of
the Church,
- in short,
the Queen of all.
In Jewish culture, the queen was
the mother of the king because kings
were often polygamous,
it made sense for the queen to be
the mother and not some arbitrary
wife. You can see this in
1 Kings 2:19:
"Bathsheba [Solomon's mother]
therefore went to King Solomon,
to speak to him for Adonijah.
And the king rose up to meet her
and bowed down to her, and sat
down on his throne and had a throne
set for the king’s mother;
so she sat at his right hand."
So King Solomon stands and bows to
her, and there is none other, in
the kingdom that the king would do
that for, than the queen. Normally,
the protocol is that the supplicant
comes in and bows before the king;
in this case, the king bows before
her, and he brought in a throne for
her, and put her at his right hand,
the place of honor. In the same manner,
we believe that Christ has done that
for his mother, Mary.
You said:
She has said
in these apparitions
"if people
do what I tell you, many souls
will be saved"
but the Bible says
"whoever calls
upon the name of the Lord (Jesus)
shall be saved."
(Romans 10:13)
For that reason, I
don't feel that am a stupid for following
the words of the Bible.
There is nothing wrong with following
those words and in fact I would urge
you to do so with all your heart.
Again, I would urge you to look at
our liturgy and see how we "call
upon the name of the Lord" so
that we may be saved. The central
character of the Mass is, in fact,
the Blood of Christ (together with
his Body), and we believe that it
is by that Blood of Christ that we
are saved.
Jesus is our Savior. It was his death
on the cross that saves us from our
sins, and it is his grace alone that
everything is ultimately predicated
on. While it is possible for us to
save people (See James 5:20 and scriptural
references), we do so only, in the
name of Christ, and through his Saving
Sacrifice.
You said:
May be it's those
who follow the other, Mary the "Queen
Of Heaven"?
We read in the Bible
that Christ is our King, but never
is there a Queen of Heaven.
- Then why do we see a woman in
Revelation chapter 12 who has
a crown of stars clothed with
the sun with the moon under her
feet — this is definitely
symbolic of both heaven and queen
— who gives birth to the
one who will rule the nations
with a iron rod (just as Mary
did) and who flees into Egypt
(just as Mary did)?
- If this is not Mary, who is it?
Answer me that question.
- And, even if it isn't Mary, isn't
it still true that someone is
the Queen of Heaven, or at least
someone is crowned with heavenly
bodies and clothed with all the
other bodies, the ancients thought
of as heavenly, thus validating
the concept?
You said:
The only Queen
mentioned in the Scriptures is an
idol which was worshiped by the pagans
and to which the Jewish women gave
offerings, bringing the wrath of
God on them.
"the children
gather wood, and the fathers kindle
the fire, and the women knead
their dough to make cakes to the
Queen of Heaven, that they may
provoke me to anger".
(Jeremiah 7:18)
Also read Jeremiah
44:17, 19, 25.
Well, God calls the pagan Nebuchadnezzar
the king of kings in Ezekiel 26:7,
yet obviously Jesus is also called
the king of kings. Just because someone
pagan is called queen of heaven in
the Old Testament, doesn't mean we
can't legitimately apply that to
someone in the New Testament.
- Am I to say that we can't call
Jesus the king of kings because
Nebuchadnezzar was called the
king of kings?
You said:
Now compare this
false Mary presented by Roman Church
who claims she is the:
- Queen of Heaven
- Queen of Apostles,
and
- Queen of Church
with the Mary of the
Bible who is clothed with humility
saying "behold the handmaid
of the Lord." — Luke 1:38
"He who exalts himself will
be humbled and he who humbles himself
will be exalted". So it makes
sense that the more humble she was,
the more she would be exalted.
You said:
One of the Ten
Commandments of God says:
"Do
not make yourself images of
anything in heaven or on earth,
do not bow down to any idols
or worship it, because I am
the Lord your God and I tolerate
no rivals".
Exodus 20:4
Clearly God did not forbid all images.
In fact, he commanded some of them,
such as:
- the bronze serpents
- the propitiatory on the ark,
and
- the adornments for the temple
(Cf. Numbers 21:4-9; John 3:14-15;
Exodus 25:18-22; 1 Kings 6:23-28;
7:23-26).
The point is whether you worship
them or not. We do not worship our
images. They are merely reminders
of those we love, and we bow to them
as one might kiss a picture of your
family.
You said:
- Why then, is the
Catholic Church filled with images
of Mary, dead saints, and other
idols etc.?
- Why are their followers
being taught to bow before them
and worship them?
Waiting for your reply
with thanks in advance,
Dr. R. Dinesh Kowsky
India
Let me quote from our official handbook
of Catholic doctrine, the Catechism
of the Catholic Church:
I. "YOU SHALL WORSHIP THE
LORD YOUR GOD AND HIM ONLY SHALL
YOU SERVE"
2084 God makes himself known by
recalling his all-powerful loving,
and liberating action in the history
of the one he addresses: "I
brought you out of the land of
Egypt, out of the house of bondage." The
first word contains the first
commandment of the Law: "You
shall fear the LORD your God;
you shall serve him. . . . You
shall not go after other gods."5
God's first call and just demand
is that man accept him and worship
him.
III. "YOU SHALL HAVE NO OTHER
GODS BEFORE ME"
2110 The first commandment forbids
honoring gods other than the one
Lord who has revealed himself
to his people. It proscribes superstition
and irreligion. Superstition in
some sense represents a perverse
excess of religion; irreligion
is the vice contrary by defect
to the virtue of religion.
Superstition
2111 Superstition is the deviation
of religious feeling and of the
practices this feeling imposes.
It can even affect the worship
we offer the true God, e.g., when
one attributes an importance in
some way magical to certain practices
otherwise lawful or necessary.
To attribute the efficacy of prayers
or of sacramental signs to their
mere external performance, apart
from the interior dispositions
that they demand, is to fall into
superstition.41
Idolatry
2112 The first commandment condemns
polytheism. It requires man neither
to believe in, nor to venerate,
other divinities than the one
true God. Scripture constantly
recalls this rejection of "idols,
[of] silver and gold, the work
of men's hands. They have mouths,
but do not speak; eyes, but do
not see." These empty idols
make their worshippers empty: "Those
who make them are like them; so
are all who trust in them."42
God, however, is the "living
God"43 who gives life and
intervenes in history.
2132 The Christian veneration
of images is not contrary to the
first commandment which proscribes
idols. Indeed, "the honor
rendered to an image passes to
its prototype," and "whoever
venerates an image venerates the
person portrayed in it."70
The honor paid to sacred images
is a "respectful veneration," not
the adoration due to God alone:
Eric
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